Interview
by Bob Stein
©2005 Bob Stein -- all rights reserved
RESTRICTED ACCESS - ALPHA-5 LEVEL PERSONNEL ONLY
WARNING - CLASSIFIED DATA
This file is under administrative control of United States Department of Health and Human Services pending review. Contents are classified -SECRET- for reasons of national security. Disclosure of all or part of the data contained within this file is a criminal offense. The United States Government reserves the right to detain any and all persons connected with this incident as deemed necessary for issues of National Security and the public welfare.
STATE OF VIRGINIA - DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH
Division of Mental Health, Mental Retardation, and Substance Abuse
Eastern State Hospital, Williamsburg
PRELIMINARY CASE REPORT
PATIENT NAME: Stein, Robert Anthony
PHYSICIAN IN ATTENDANCE: Dayton, Michael A., Ph. D.
ID#: 271299-0003
DATE: 12/27/99-17:52
(NOTE: Transcript of patient interview has been edited due to speech difficulties. See attached affidavit of authenticity and approval signed by patient.)
| PHYS: | Hello, Mr. Stein. I'm Doctor Dayton. <pause> There's no need for embarrassment. |
| STEIN: | That's easy for you to say. You're not on candid camera. |
| PHYS: | I'm sorry -- I don't understand. |
| STEIN: | Look, if you want to talk to me, at least have the courtesy to be honest. Or do all of your rooms have such big wall mirrors? |
| PHYS: | Would you prefer to have the mirror covered? |
| STEIN: | <agitated> What I would prefer would be to have something to cover myself! They even took the damned sheets off the bed! |
| PHYS: | Are you ashamed of your appearance? |
| STEIN: | <pause> Ashamed? Are you out of your <expletive deleted> mind? I'm a horse! I don't even understand my app... appa... <pause> the way I look! But I'm not used to parading around naked in front of strangers, either. |
| PHYS: | I'm a doctor, Mr. Ste- <cut off> |
| STEIN: | <agitated> Dammit! They aren't, are they? Government people here for a freak show, right? <loud noise> Watch this, you bastards! <loud noise> |
| PHYS: | <to intercom> I'm fine. Do not interrupt the session. <to patient> I'm sorry, Mr. Stein. Please understand that this is a highly unusual situation. |
| STEIN: | <laugh/snort?> You're telling me? <pause> I'm sorry about the bed. Guess I don't know my own strength. |
| PHYS: | <to intercom> Please bring some sheets to the room, please. Now. And the largest robe available. <pause> <to patient> Is there anything else I can get you? |
| STEIN: | How about an escort out of this place? |
| PHYS: | <pause> I'm not in a position to do that. I'm very sorry. |
| STEIN: | <no response> |
| PHYS: | I could order the observation room cleared, but to be honest, I don't think I have much say. |
| STEIN: | <pause> Am I a prisoner? |
| PHYS: | This is a hospital, Mr. Stein. You are here for psychiatric evaluation. |
| STEIN: | On what basis? I haven't done anything to warrant this, and you know it. |
| PHYS: | <pause> You -are- aware of the changes in your physical appearance? |
| STEIN: | Why do you think I went to the hospital? I was looking for help, and I got kidnapped by the God-damned Government! |
| PHYS: | Any sudden, serious physical change can result in mental trauma. In extreme cases such as yours -- <cut off> |
| STEIN: | <agitated> What? Such as mine? You've got to be kidding me! <Pause> Have you ever seen or heard of a case like mine? |
| PHYS: | <pause> I'm sorry. No. I was thinking of cases where people have lost limbs, or suffered serious disfigurements. |
<Break in interview -- sheets and robe delivered to room>
| PHYS: | We could see if there is something else. |
| STEIN: | No, the sheet will be OK. I didn't expect them to have a robe in my size, anyway. |
<Pause in conversation, sound of material tearing, rustling>
| STEIN: | Guess that's some better. Too bad the sheet isn't plaid. I could pretend it was a kilt. Appropriate for the look. |
| PHYS: | Sorry? |
| STEIN: | A kilt. I seem to be Clydesdale. They're Scottish horses. <pause> Damn! These weird fingers don't work very well. |
| PHYS: | Do you need some help? |
| STEIN: | No, thanks. Guess I have to learn how to function like this. I think I can... there. That should hold. Buttons and zippers are out, but I can still tie a rope. For now, at least. |
| PHYS: | For now? Do you think you won't be able to function later? |
| STEIN: | <pause> I don't know. Everything is so confusing. I don't know if I am still changing, or if I'm just noticing more horse stuff. |
| PHYS: | Such as? |
| STEIN: | <pause> I guess you heard that I... <pause> soiled the room before you got here. |
| PHYS: | That is nothing to be ashamed of. In times of stress -- <cut off> |
| STEIN: | Oh, come off it, Doctor! This isn't a normal situation. I took a dump and a piss like a horse. And what came out looked and smelled like it came from a horse. Take my word for it. I've seen the real stuff. |
| PHYS: | Are you afraid that you are still changing? |
| STEIN: | Hell, yes! What else do you expect? I went to bed human last night, and woke up like this. Maybe tomorrow I'll be a horse for real! I'm not that far from it now. |
| PHYS: | Have you noticed any mental changes? |
| STEIN: | <agitated> You people gave me all the tests. What do -you- think? |
| PHYS: | Look, Mr. Stein. I know this is a very difficult time for you. And I won't pretend to understand what has happened. All I want to do is talk to you, and help you cope with this situation. |
| STEIN: | And give the Government with a good excuse to keep me locked up. |
| PHYS: | You're here for your own protec... <pause> Oh, Hell! Look, Mr. Stein. I really do want to help you as much as I can. But we both know that your situation is somewhat, well, unusual. People are scared. The people on the other side of that glass are trying to do what's best for everyone. I'm here to help you. Just you. And I can't do that unless you cooperate. |
| STEIN: | <pause> I guess it doesn't matter. Look, I'll tell you what I can. Could you give me some straight answers, first? |
| PHYS: | I'll try. What do you want to know? |
| STEIN: | The psych tests -- what did they show? |
| PHYS: | It's too early to be -- <Cut off> |
| STEIN: | You want me to be honest with you? You be honest with me. Not knowing is a lot worse, no matter what the answers are. |
| PHYS: | OK. <pause> <to intercom> Considering the violations of patient privacy that have already occurred, I will not abide by the disclosure restrictions where they interfere with the patient's right to know. |
| INTERCOM: | Proceed. (Agent P. Randolph) |
| STEIN: | Did you guys buy tickets? Or am I on cable? <No response> |
| PHYS: | <to patient> You're an intelligent man, Mr. Stein. What did you think about the tests? |
| STEIN: | I figure I did pretty well -- if I was ten or eleven years old. |
| PHYS: | Why? |
| STEIN: | Reading com... comp... <pause> Knowing what I read. I had trouble with some of the words. Math was worse. |
| PHYS: | You're pretty much on target. The initial evaluation pegs your academic skills at Fourth Grade level in English, and Second Grade in Math. Social and communication skills are still rated as adult, with limited indications of juvenile behavior patterns. |
| STEIN: | <pause> <laugh?> That last is probably normal for me. |
| PHYS: | Could be. We don't have any test data from... <pause> before. It does match up with what we got from family and neighbors. |
| STEIN: | How are they? My parents? They aren't locked up, are they? |
| PHYS: | Of course not! What... <pause> I understand your concern. To my knowledge, they were interviewed at home, and have been given clearance to visit you later. I -will- make sure that is the case, and I will let you know later. |
| STEIN: | What about Marty, my neighbor? She freaked out pretty bad when she saw me. |
| PHYS: | <Pause> I don't have any information on her. I'll check on her condition as well. |
| STEIN: | Thanks. |
| PHYS: | Anything else? |
| STEIN: | Can you tell me what happened? Was it just me? |
| PHYS: | We don't know. So far, you are the only person we know of. If there are any others, they haven't come forward. |
| STEIN: | What about all the other tests? They must have taken a quart of blood out of me. Not to mention samples of everything from hair to semen. |
| PHYS: | It's only been a few hours, and I'm not really involved in the physical testing. The initial reports had body chemistry and DNA samples matching normal readings for an equine. |
| STEIN: | <pause> I'm a horse. |
| PHYS: | The lab data is equine, yes. What's important is that your mental faculties, while somewhat reduced, remain mostly human. |
| STEIN: | <pause> Be careful what you wish for. |
| PHYS: | Pardon? |
| STEIN: | This is something I have wondered about for years. Even wished for. Becoming a horse. Or a centaur. |
| PHYS: | <pause> Yes. I looked at your web site and read the Transformation page. There are a lot of stories on your computer, as well. |
| STEIN: | Damn! I guess they don't worry about rights to privacy around here, do they? It doesn't matter, I guess. I couldn't use a computer with these fingers, anyway. |
| PHYS: | Probably not. |
| STEIN: | <pause> What happens after this? |
| PHYS: | After what? |
| STEIN: | This interview. Am I being committed? |
| PHYS: | No. You are just here for testing. They plan to move you to a facility at Camp Peary. |
| STEIN: | The Spook base. |
| PHYS: | Pardon? Oh, yes. It belongs to the CIA. |
| STEIN: | <no response> |
| PHYS: | Is that all? |
| STEIN: | <pause> One really big question. Probably the biggest one. Am I still human? |
| PHYS: | Every indication is that you retain your human mind, at least mostly. |
| STEIN: | That's not what I asked. In -your- opinion, am I still human? Or a Clydesdale that walks on its hind legs and talks? |
| PHYS: | The truth? |
| STEIN: | <pause> Please. |
| PHYS: | When I look at you, I see a horse. Your eyes, your movements, the way your ears lay back. Even your smell. But when I talk to you, I hear a human being inside. I couldn't have a conversation like this with a horse. And a horse wouldn't think to ask these questions. So in my opinion, both personal and professional, you are still a human being. |
| STEIN: | <long pause> Thanks. |
<Long break -- silence>
| PHYS: | Can I ask some questions now? |
| STEIN: | OK. |
| PHYS: | How long have you had an interest in horses? |
| STEIN: | Most of my life, I guess. I never took lessons or anything. Come to think of it, I didn't really have much contact with horses until I started college. |
| PHYS: | What happened in college? |
| STEIN: | One of my professors had two horses and I helped her with them. Funny thing was, she was scared of them. |
| PHYS: | Scared of her own horses? |
| STEIN: | Terrified. I used to do a lot of cleaning and grooming. She was a really nice person, and I enjoyed the horses. |
| PHYS: | Were they mean horses? |
| STEIN: | Not to me. They snapped at some of the other students, but they always came right to me. |
| PHYS: | Did you want to be a horse then? |
| STEIN: | <pause> No. <pause> This is pretty embarrassing. |
| PHYS: | Why? |
| STEIN: | Having to explain why I would want to be like this. Or a complete animal. |
| PHYS: | Is that what you want? |
| STEIN: | I don't know. I mean, this is so hard to believe. Maybe after it sinks in that I'm not having some long-term hali.. halu..<pause> that I'm not imagining all this, I might feel differently. |
| PHYS: | What -do- you feel? |
| STEIN: | <pause> I'm scared. Really scared. I don't want to spend the rest of my life locked up in a lab somewhere, and I sure don't want to be cut up and stored in little glass jars. But part of me is excited and happy, too. It's.. <pause> I don't know if I can explain it. |
| PHYS: | Try. Use whatever words you want. Don't worry about making sense. Just talk to me about it. |
| STEIN: | It's all so different. Sort of what I expected when I imagined being changed, but a lot of stuff I didn't think about. |
| PHYS: | How so? |
| STEIN: | The way my body feels. I can feel my skin. Not just when I touch it, but all the time. <pause> See that? My shoulder? I can twitch the skin there. There are little muscles all over that I didn't have before. |
| PHYS: | Like your tail? |
| STEIN: | That's a really odd feeling. The hair pulls, and when I lift it, my whole butt seems to loosen up. Part of the horse thing, I guess. That's what started my, well, accident. My face is really weird, too. Like my lips and nostrils are made of rubber -- really thick and way bigger than they were. |
| PHYS: | Is it better than being human? |
| STEIN: | <pause> Better? <pause> I don't know. Different, for sure. Maybe after I've been like this a while, I can say better. |
| PHYS: | Did you do anything special over the past few days, anything that might help explain what happened to you? |
| STEIN: | I've been asked that a million times today. No. Nothing that I can think of. I mean, I have always been interested in being a horse. And trans... trins... <pause> changing into an animal. When I was a kid, I even tried a couple of ceremonies that were supposed to turn me into a werewolf. |
| PHYS: | Really? What did those involve? |
| STEIN: | Oh, nothing kinky or dangerous. I said some chant I found in a book and stabbed a tree stump with a copper knife. Hammered a penny out to make it. And I stripped once under a full moon for another one. <pause> Stupid, I know. I was a kid. |
| PHYS: | There are a lot of items related to horses listed as being in your house. Did you perform any ceremonies with them? |
| STEIN: | <snort/laugh?> No. I guess it seems really silly, but most of them were for stories. I do that a lot. If I see something that makes me think of a story, I'll buy it. Pictures, toys, games. |
| PHYS: | Is there anything different you can think of? Attitude, emotions, even a particularly strong idea for a horse story? |
| STEIN: | No. I mean, I always have ideas. If you have a list of the stories on my computer, you know I write a lot. Writing out an idea always makes it more real to me. |
| PHYS: | <pause> You talked about feeling different physically. How about mentally? |
| STEIN: | I don't know. |
| PHYS: | You don't want to talk about it? |
| STEIN: | No, I just don't know if I feel different that way. I know I'm not as smart as I was before, at least with the school stuff. That doesn't bother me, and it should. |
| PHYS: | Why? |
| STEIN: | Why what? |
| PHYS: | Why should losing part of your education bother you? A horse doesn't need an education. |
| STEIN: | So now you think I'm a horse? |
| PHYS: | Do you? |
| STEIN: | <pause> Oh. Trick question. I get it. |
| PHYS: | It doesn't matter what I think. Or what they think. What do YOU think? |
| STEIN: | Like you said before, if I can think of the question, I'm not a horse. <pause> Say, what time is it? |
| PHYS: | About 6 p.m. |
| STEIN: | Any way we can get the news? |
| PHYS: | Why? |
| STEIN: | Like I said, I've been thinking about this kind of thing for a long time. Lucky for me, some other people I know are more paranoid. They made me realize that this is where I'd end up if the impossible came true. So I made some arrangements. |
| PHYS: | Arrangements? What are you talking about? |
| INTERCOM: | We have a blackout imposed on your neighbor, your parents, and the hospital staff. Everyone who knows is being watched. |
| STEIN: | Not quite. I had another friend come over first thing this morning, before I called Marty. I didn't know if this was real or not until I saw his face. Lucky for me, he didn't freak. I had him shoot videotape and take pictures. I didn't want publicity, but I needed something to protect myself. Either he got them to the TV stations and a lawyer by now, or it doesn't matter. |
| INTERCOM: | You sent a tape out? To who? This is a classified matter! <Agent S. Paulsen> |
| STEIN: | <agitated> This is MY life. |
| INTERCOM: | <expletive deleted> bastard! Do you know what kind of panic this could cause? Somebody turn on the TV. Call the FCC. See if we can block broadcasts. Oh, <expletive deleted>! It's already on! <Agents J. Harding, S. Paulsen> |
| PHYS: | I think we can dispense with any further questions, Mr. Stein. I don't care for this environment any more than you do. |
| INTERCOM: | We haven't ended this, Dayton! He is still under CIA protection! <Agent J. Harding> |
| PHYS: | I hereby pronounce this patient sane. And I will testify in a court of law to that effect. Now, unless you want to explain to the general public and a Court of Law why you are holding this man prisoner, I suggest you make some 'protection' arrangements that are more to his liking. |
END TRANSCRIPT